Directory Site Profits 102- The Continuation- Back To The Basics- and THEN Some!

Work a bit on formatting the text, John.

John, what you say about having less struggle with a directory site, on the other side it scares me. Imagine Google deleting the directory? They start to do this already by banning for unnatural links, you never know what they have in mind for the future.

*Yes, now it's better.

You are thinking to hard. As it is most of the warriors here have no problem putting their business fate in Google's hands by only offering seo or other related services. Those can be, and have been taken down more and more with each Google update.

I really do not see Google getting down to the niche level directories, which is what John is talking about here. They are looking more at the big picture, not just the little plastic mold sites, or any other niche for that matter.


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My answer: Yes.

John, a couple of years ago I invested time and money into trying to get a Directory Site off the ground. My motive was to help 'little guy' businesses and I expected to see a nice monthly revenue stream from it as well.

Best laid plans go awry, and this did too.

Hard to get ranked and very small clients were interested and some bought into it, but I never could make it profitable. At least in my experience, unless I charged almost 'peanuts', it was not worth continuing.

However, you may be focused on a better way.

I'd agree, if the niche isn't filled with 'Big Guy' directories (YelP, Dex), SEO will not be so tough...

and if the clients listed all stood to gain large dollar transactions with even a few referrals, that would change the picture. I never tried anything like that.

The thing I always liked about the "Directory Concept" was the ongoing revenue stream, vs. 'hunt and peck' for new clients all the time.
_____
Bruce

maricelu,

You know I got love for ya.

This is my stock answer to that question, not to belittle your concern...:

"I'll have to check my Mayan calender and get back to you on that one"

Great post John. I'm looking forward to your next "installment".

The idea of spending more time choosing the perfect niche is very timely. With so many other marketers entering the offline arena, it's time to think outside the box, that's for sure.

Niches with high ticket items, low competition (and therefore easier seo) is a good start.

I'd like to hear more about your favorite Directory Themes (WP of course - what else would be build this beast on?!) and then some of the methods you use to get the word out re: these Directories to the businesses that need to be in them.

Also, this is definitely not just a "local" thing, is it? Your Model example would have models from all over the country (or even the world) though now that I have written that I suppose it would have to be local for them to get work (pic, video, etc) but there must be tons of niches that could go national/world.

My thought re: niche selection is that the narrower you go, the better. Specialists of any sort will ultimately be able to charge more for services, and therefore be apt to pay more to be included in the Directory. Fun stuff.

I'll be subscribing to this thread for sure.

Thanks again!

Rob

[quote=John Durham)
Must be what they are saying on the phone...
[/quote]

My bet is that it has more to do with YP and the other big dogs staying on the phone than anything their pitch says. Having hundreds of sales people is going to make a difference. Heck just having one or two that never hang the phone up will make a big difference in how many sales are brought in.


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@ Rob

As far as word press Rob, Im no design expert, what I teach is about the site layout and the sales strategy. Although, for the reports etc... I have a guy from here in the offline forum writing a report for working with scripts... to help the guys who work with them.

In my case, I design the layouts and hand it to a designer, in fact David Stewart is working on one at this very moment that I just sent the layout for yesterday... I dont know what theme he is going to use and dont care... My customers will not even look at the site until after they are sold on the phone in 90% of the cases.

In any event, I know he will pick a nice theme those details are "fat" to me, the biggie is the sales system. People have less trouble around here finding ways to design sites than they do finding ways to make sales... Isnt that always the case?

Busy work...sheeesh! (JK)

As long as the site works its fine for my purposes. As long as it can produce a lead, its fine for my customer's.

If I can sell listings from it, it will be beautiful to me! lol

I'll tell you my own niche that Im going to try it with "Hospital Medical Equipment Wholesalers". Not because of any research Ive done, although there are some good exact match domain names available for sure... but more because I know guys that work in the field, and they will do just about ANYTHING to increase their chances of making sales.

Also their tickets are bigger so there is better ROI potential should the sight only produce a handful of leads here and there.

But, in answer to your question I dont personally know the first thing about Word Press, and thats my bad.... It seems easy enough to learn.

With all of that being said...

I stand by this... you could build one with drag and drop if you wanted.

My first modeling directory started that way, then after about my first 50 customers, I had a guy redesign it later, just for design purposes, not for functionality, and we sold listings out the ying yang (lol his name was Bo Yang actually).

I forget which program I was using at the time I started it, maybe an earlier version of intuit.

Very basic.

This may not apply to what you are saying but...

People get more complicated than they really need to... honestly I dont like anything that distracts from the simple function that a directory site performs.

Ialso learned early on from Bowers that the only thing bells and whistles do is keep people from going to the listings and ringing up the customers. they can hold visitors up on their way to becoming a lead for your client, in other words. An extra option here or there, and suddenly the vistors are getting lost on the way home to your clients form...know whut Im sayin?

I think people get lost in OPTIONS forever sometimes, and suffer from analysis paralysis, so thats how I have always done better (on the phone for example) by cutting away the fat and just getting to the clear point wherever possible.

Another thing people do is get so invested in a plan that they arent flexible, which (flexibility) is ALWAYS necessary after you start the sales process in one way or another, whether its tweaking your offer, your pitch or your entire niche... and so because it didnt work with the system they laid out, they say it didnt work... the problem is that they invested too much energy into their system before they got it "working" and then were too invested to be flexible.

Its best to travel light, go with simple, and keep yourself flexible for whatever you find when you get on the phone. Which cant even be determined before a few hundred calls are made.

So 300 bad calls isnt a failure, its a distinction making juncture.

Again, I like to cut away the fat, and be as lean and mean and results driven as possible.

For instance, you arent gonna get the whiskers and cheese thing here... or false intentions, if I see a thread getting hot, Im not going to mess around getting to the point I will just tell you "Hey, this thread is hot. Im doing a wso on it...lol"

I think that helps me sell better, because I dont waste my time or anyone elses, and I dont go the long way around trying to be sneaky and insult your intelligence.

Getting to the point is kind of a way of life in general, cutting the fat.

What I see in alot of these "looming" design ideas... is alot of fat that is going to keep people from getting to the point.

A: Build a site that is about something, ie; local travel.
B: Rank It.
C: Give it a "search listings" tab
D: Load it with 3 line listings for about 20-30 businesses
E: Start selling one page listings and growing your site and customer base.

Dont do anything else till you have 100 listings sold.

Dont think about savvier designs or ANYTHING, until you are selling listings like clock work... Thats the meat and potatoes.

Dont look back till you have a hundred customers, and PREPARE yourself, that the first few hundred calls arent gonna make it happen... lol.

It may take three hundred just to get your pitch out consistently, but if a million dollars is worth it to you, you will stay on the phone for two weeks until you can do it like yesterday's news and close deals while you are watching TV!

Get your site up basic, so you can hurry up and get into sales.

Everything else is gravy and isnt worth the energy till your system is working.

My biggest fear in sharing this is that people will get so wrapped up in things Im not even talking about...that they will lose the whole concentrated power of what could happen if they just went basic, straight forward...no frills... and just created a site that ranked and started selling listings.

Alot of times in Phone rooms they feel like training really just keeps people from getting on the phone and banging out their scripts... The basic principles you need to succeed on the phone come more quickly taking a basic script and banging it out till you are good than they come from all kinds of intricate training that you wont understand anyway till you are 500 calls in. Some things you wont understand until you have closed your first deal even...

I think the design of these sites in peoples minds could work much the same way... No need to worry about alot of bells and whistles. Really.

The biggest temptation in this whole model is going to be the temptation to do a bunch of stuff that you dont really have to do, which takes energy away from banging out the sales.

As far as National or Local?

If you have a decent sales team you can sell either...the reason being is that a sales team hums at a certain level of energy.... if you can generate that energy by yourself you can sell 3-5 listings a day just like I did on the phone when I started working for bower... The key is your sales work rhythm.

Not you, I know you arent thinking this way...

But alot of people will try to intellectualize certain things Im saying... and they wont really get it until they are in the sales action.

Then they are going to DOUBT it , till they get the hang of it and make a sale... because naturally no matter what you sell thats going to come in.

However,

If you are in a good rythem, it wont matter that national sites are harder, or that local sites are easier... It will all work the same for you.

As far as SEO on a national site... You would be hard pressed to have 1000 page site in ANY niche, with any amount of keyword rich content on the pages and basic onsite optimization... and not get some search engine love even with minimal SEO and thats what we are striving for!

Im not going this deep into the details here because most of you will find out soon enough, but another reason for picking industrial or manufacturing type niches is because Alibaba, and 50 other international trade sites all get really good google love... and most of them will allow you to list 50 products... or product "description" pages, which can be used as powerful backlinks...

When you choose a niche thats a bit obscure that means the places where you might back link from are also more diverse... So thats another bonus.

For instance, again, Alibaba back links have alot of power and you can optimize entire pages of product descriptions... in this case your product might be...oh I dont know.... Plastic injection molding?

Cool huh.

There are alot of good ideas and ways to promote if you think outside of the box.

Again, Bowers was just the first of my directory site experiences... so I can tell you alot of diverse angles on them.

I can tell you without a doubt that your bet is a sure thing! I would put $1,000 on that bet.

Ps. I said above "300 bad calls isnt failure, its a dinstinction making juncture".

Most new first day telemarketers in a call center make that many calls before their first break...so yeah, I agree. Until us professionals can reach the level in a week, that a telemarketer does before they even go to first break, we may have trouble seeing how they do it.

Different perspective altogether after you have momentum.

Here's the blessing in that "If a half stoned, burnt out telemarketer who just smoked a joint before he walked in, can make 2 -3 sales a day and 300 calls before their first break, 5 days a week, then certainly an upwardly mobile sober guy like me can at least do twice as good"!

Guys, I just typed this post in the blink of an eye, faster than some can write a report, and theres only one reason; its because I know this stuff 100 times over, it doesnt require alot of deep thought. Trust me.

Another awesome post John, thanks!

I agree wholeheartedly with your take on the design of the Directory - it doesn't matter. Keep it simple, functional and easy for prospects to become leads and businesses will buy in.

I'm on top of things with design and seo, I LOVE talking with business owners and helping their businesses grow. I've been consulting for several years and have always thought about starting a directory, but never much beyond that.

I LOVE the model.

Step 1 for me is to identify that high ticket, low competition, specialist niche and then run with the ball.

Any specific tips or direction to send me to find that niche?

I'm all ears!

Rob

Rob, look through the "thomas registry" online, you will see alot of out of the box niches we dont normally think of... whew. I think I wore myself out on that last post. lol

Believe it or not, some of the best projects I have ever done were ones that I just went with my gut, without alot of research... but then people lose millions that way too so Im not giving out that advice, just sayin it has worked that way for me alot.

Certainly "telemarketing" wouldnt have seemed like a good IM niche from a research perspective , but WAS.

There was a big pocket in the niche with offliners that would have been hard to identify through normal research, but it was something "i" wanted to do....turns out I was right and I "could" make a niche out of it.

Some paths are better carved by yourself.

Another example would be selling truckloads of wallpaper overseas on Alibaba....the research would say it was the suckiest market on earth, ESPECIALLY if you researched Alibaba itself... but I happened to get into it and found a hole accidentally.

Alot of things that seem correct in theory are different when you start working them. Alot of it just depends on how much you want to do something.

I would find some things that met your 3 criteria, and just go with the one that turned me on the most.

Aha Directory Site Profits 102 is here. Good stuff John.

I'm going to stop looking for the perfect directory script now and start working on a site instead

From the research I conducted months ago, I found that too many directory sites (at least some of the more local ones that I've seen) are filled with too much noise. They are very "busy" and have a lot going on.

I've currently been working on a directory site project over the last few months an I'm sooooo close to getting it all wrapped up, except I'm going about mine a little differently. With the release date coming up June 1st, the month of May is going to be extremely busy.

Rather than worry about a script, I built my directory solely using CSS and HTML. While the coding isn't "cutting edge", I prefer to keep things simple. I also incorporated a unique (and much easier) way to use my directory, along with pages that are easy to read. Simple, easy and effective - just how it should be.

Just like John mentioned above, anyone looking to pursue directory-style websites need to STOP worrying about scripts, layouts, intricate and "cutting edge" design and just put something together to get the ball rolling. You will be surprised at what you can come up with once you get moving.

Krysziek,

I will try to come hit this tomorrow when I have a little time, finishing up the bower report this late night... One of the things Im running into lately is that writing reports is as easy as just spewing your natural knowledge, but things like posting scripts and email templates is actually alot harder and more time consuming than writing reports, because you have to consider all the individual variables and built them specifically around that individuals situations.

Not to vent, but I have put more work into writing two phone scripts this week than I have the enitre bower report, they almost arent worth it to write for less than 1k to be honest.

Anyway, I will come back and try to answer this, or else help you with it on the follow up thread.

I love helping people like yourself, so much that I put my all into it which can bite me in the rear at times and I end up spending more time here than I plan, but dont want to make you feel bad for asking. Im honored that you did.

Again, will probably cover stuff this detailed in the follow up support thread.

Hi John,

Understood that you are busy, no problems!! And you don't have too put too much effort into a response for me, even just some pointers / ideas that *you* would focus on if you were in my situation. The rest I am sure I can try and blend in - but someone like yourself knows better than I do in regards to 'which' points I should focus on in the promo.

IE - really focusing on 'getting in front of 20,000 local residents' is something you might consider to be the most important, etc.

Good luck with your current work, hope you wrap it up in good time!

Chris

Damn JD! I take a couple of days off from reading the WF and look what happens! Great thread. I love the directory site model but haven't been able to "sort it all out" in my head - this should help.

Hey John,

Really like your 2 threads on directories.

I believe you stated you would sell display ads on your directory. I'd be the first business to take one. Why, I'm new and want to start out with your directory first, and dominate it.

How would I dominate it, assuming I have the money to advertise on John's directory.

Put a "Whats in it for them", rather than a listing of services and products sold which is the way all businesses advertise.

Instead of: We make service calls try.

Try something like this instead: Are you stuck at the office or home and can't get away. We save you time and expense of bringing your car to us by doing oil changes and small repairs at your (business site or home).

Some of you are going to say it will not work. Listing products and services has always brought calls to our business and you've grown leaps and bounds because of your advertising. Besides, we're on the first page of google and if you don't know it, thats where everyone looks so this doesn't help.

Ok, you're on the first page of google and you are receiving calls. I bet most of those calls ask you the price for the services their seeking. Then they go to the next competitor and the next, and so on until they just say ok, when can you be here.

Do yourself a favor and stop them in their tracks by giving them a reason to call you instead of your competitor.

Same with directories, if your building them, give the business a reason to put their business in.

I think what you are describing is an assumptive lead in. I wont write a whole pitch but it may start something like:

Hey Bob this is ________ calling with ______ Hope you are doing well today.

(pause slightly, not long enough to be awkward)

Great.

Briefly Bob, I was calling today because we are a local online__________ directory site, and currently we are in the process of putting up free listings of all the local _________businesses in the area, so our site visitors will have more options to choose from...

I just wanted to call real quick and make sure I had your address right before we put your listing up, thats going to be_____________ correct?

Okay great, and what are your hours of operation BOB?

And Im assuming you are also open on weekends?

Great.

BTW Bob, is this the phone number you want posted on your listing?

(If they say yes you are committing them to "wanting" something- proceed)

Okay Great thats all I need, BTW Bob, do you folks have a web page up ?

The reason I asked is because... (Now sell the premium listing).


Next you pitch the listing, and assume interest without asking for it, and start asking more questions all the way to the close.

Thats rough idea, but should be a good start. This isnt the pitch Im going to be using, but I have used variations of it alot and it works. basically its an assumptive greeting style, and the pitching style is sort of a questionnaire style.

Each question designed to sell the prospect through his own inward dialogue, and each answer he gives further commits him emotionally and verbally, until he is ready to close.

Hey guys, I am building right now a directory following John's awesome method and I think I will get it done this week. So, I am looking for a partner who will want to do the sales part ( i.e. cold-calling) and we will split the profits 50/50. Please PM anyone who is good at this and is interested in collaborating with me, not just ask what niche I am following

Marcel

Great stuff as always John....
I like the outside the box niches with the register.

I remember when there was a company going around putting on conferences to sell people on their program. Which involved finding businesses in the register without a website. Creating a website for them. Then, having them share a portion of the proceeds the site generated with you. Forgot all about that until your post.

P.S.- When is that report coming out? Enough with the anticipation!

Quick Thought guys.

Here is what I like about this. When you are working on a directory site model, you are working toward building a real business that is going to serve you for the longterm, as opposed to just making a random sale here and there which we can ALL do in our sleep by now... but it doesnt really end up building a business that is sustainable for most of us.

This biz has longterm potential and actually "grows" by its very nature... This isnt "landing a client or two here and there and building them a site.", this is BUILDING something for YOU that is going to be strong and last because its a "chord made of many strands" that isnt easily broken.

Building it is worthwhile because once its there you will be aweful hard to break...

Some are going to say "Google can break you".... Well they can break you now too, so if they are going to slap you its better if you have a strong business that can withstand it.

In any event , I think of this as actually building something that grows, instead of living from sale to sale.

You are also building something that can be resold later for 10 times its value and is attractive to investors and business developers.

Just a thought.

This thread is worth it's weight in internet gold.

Hello forum, I am very new here and I find this method to be very good for starters like me. I have tried some weeks ago to call businesses in my nearest city and offer them a website and charge for hosting but I've found this beign too stressfull for me. I think this may work and I was looking for someone who is good at closing these deals maybe make a recording to their call and put it here. I think it may be something usefull, for me, at least.

God bless, Gluh

Try going to the google keyword research tool and typing in the word "Photography", or "Portraits".

Try "wedding photo's" or "wedding portraits"

Actually just try the first two, photography, and portraits, and it will give you a list of suggestions- you may have better luck.

If not , then be like a telemarketer. Telemarketers dont get hung up on every call and married to the idea that "This prospect has to be my sale", instead they take each one with a grain of salt (ie; "not too seriously") until they find one that they feel they have a reasonable chance of closing , and they give all their energy to THAT one.

In other words, dont get stuck on a pre conceived notion when you are doing your research, unless you have a particular passion for this... Rather look for something thats going to work, with no emotional attachment to the various ideas except the ones that look like they might work.

If you "are" passionate about photography in particular though, you may have to do what I have done online with offline IM "telemarketing" concept...

And what is that?

Carve your own niche out where there wasnt one before, and fight and claw until you can make it something there is alot of interest in.

You do this by spreading awareness.

This niche may not be worth all of that to you, but then it MAY. Just depends on "HOW' passionately you feel about it.

Hope this helps... I think its the keyword itself thats the issue, try some different variations... or try some other niches, or other geographical areas. If there is little search traffic in your area you may have to expand your geography.

Where there is a will theres a way.


In short though, for starters "photograph Services" isnt a good keyword to start your research with because I believe universally "photographer" is closer to what you intended... Keep digging around that. Portraits, photos, wedding pictures... try some more variations of the word.

This is the issue with MOST people trying to achieve offline success...They have the web design skills .... but they arent comfortable selling.

There are always junctures in your journey where the option to turn back shows itself... for most here its the part where you have to "sell".

People will try anything to get around that... If you guys want this to work then "selling" is the key, not so much being able to build websites. Selling is what makes a business.

So yeah, you may have to find someone else to do it for you...this is the place where 50% will turn back right away...but its the place that 100% of the successful ones have to get themselves through....but 0% will be successful if they refuse to sell....or refuse to go through the fire of finding someone who can.... its the difference between whether you will be a tech or an entrepreneur.

Here's the good part: Its your chooice to make, and you can be the one who chooses to move forward while others fall off.

You are the one who will know how it "works", while others can only tell the story of how it didnt.

Designing websites is just a hobby or a skill you can write on a job application, until you can "sell". When you can "sell" though, the sky is the limit.

Thats why I feel I can help with this more than others who know 100 times what I do about SEO.

Thats another reason I was able to identify this telemarketing niche....there wasnt alot of interest, but there was alot of "need", and once it was pointed out,or "the awareness was spread", people recognized that truth in their own experience.

You can spread awareness about areas where there is need, even if there isnt interest and people own inward dialogue will recognize if you are speaking the truth.

People dont believe what you say....they believe what you say that lines up with what they have "experienced", and most here have experienced that technical skills alone dont make a business.... Sales or Marketing skills do.

Im going to teach you how to "sell" this, just hold onto your horses.

Hey guys, I've been thinking about setting up a directory site for a while now, and this thread has motivated me to act.

I live in city with a population of around 45,000. I've researched the market, and found out that there are 36 local searches per month for the exact matched keyword "[city] restaurants".

I'm pretty sure if I build a directory site revolving around this keyword, I could rank it on the first page considering that [city]restaurants.com is available and the top10 competition is weak.

Should I pursue and build the directory site? What are your thoughts?

Thanks

No need lirihk,

I edited my post above and gave you a better answer. Yeah if I wanted to I would do it anyway. If you can say you are number one thats a great selling point in any town.

Where do you live that is a very small number of searches per month for something as popular as restaurants?

EDIT: Never mind I see John has already asked and you responded while I was making coffee.

I want to thank John for inspiring me through his two threads on Directory sites that made me take action and registered a domain name for "houses for rent in 'city'" dot com.

It is under propagation, once done propagation, I will start building the site right away. The niche does not even need to get first page or first spot ranking coz there are lot of hungry people looking to rent a house in my city.

Once the word is spread, it will automatically start ranking and people will help me get social marketing too coz of the type and niche chosen, IMO.

This is a great wealth of info about directory style websites. Any of you here who have this up and running or just about to, what platform are you using to actually build this baby on?

I can see massive potential in my area for this but i want to build this sucker and just need some options to choose from. I have seen directorypress, not sure how customizable the theme is. Also heard of a new theme out called vantage by appthemes. Does anyone here use either of these ?

Hey folks silly question...does Directory Press support monthly automatic recurring payments for my advertisers thru PayPal, etc. ?

Thanks for the insight I am working on a site now which is almost exactly what you are referring to but I was getting hung up on SEO rankings etc. I can now concentrate on getting my letters out to the prospects. Thanks again Bob.

What directory CMS would you recommend? I have seen some but not sure which one is the best to work with?

BRILLIANCE! Nice thread John. With your idea of "plastic Mold Injection companies" you opened up my eyes to major manufacturing activity in my own area that no one had created a directory for. Thanks.

Alright. Im going to change my 90 day plan darn it, I have sold myself into it- 10k per month is 10k per month right?

Im going to do a directory site.

I have been a bit uneasy about my choice of models honestly since starting the other because this model makes alot more sense.

Go for it John! We we want to heat all about it right here

Come on guys ! for those who are already doing this with some success, what platform are you using to create the directory site? Im not to keen on googling for reviews of themes or scripts as we all know most review sites are trying to sell rather than an honest review. I would prefer a review of a theme or script from someone here who is already doing this.

Im not after any hold my hand stuff but more of a "take a look at this or that theme" or "this one works well for me"

I got a friend how is getting big traffic to her site, 5k-15k daily. She now wants to create a directory site as an ad-on. This is something lots of her visitors are asking her, so of course we have to give them what they want right?

The best i have found is edirectory if you can afford it

Just wrote out a long reply but it timed out and I don;t feel like retyping it.

Thanks Shay, Little gestures will add up to cement the relationships with your clients.

Hi guys I've got questions.
How do you go about populating you directory in the beginning I assume you check YP right but how do you get paid when their business is already listed in your directory?
You cant have a directory website without populating it right

Sorry if this is a stupid question I can't get my head around on how to start the directory

How many local searches per month warrant creating a local directory?

I would not touch that niche here in sydney unless i was going to go really tight like "italian restaurant in sydney" just sydney restaurant would be too tough to get a foothold

Hi guys... I just purchased John's report...I am so pumped. I am wanting to do a directory for technology providers + city. What are your thoughts. Too vague?

Vantage theme it is for me. Reason being they have it available in the language i need{Spanish} and also because they will be adding an events feature in the near future which is something we will be needing soon. I could not find anywhere any info if directorypress comes with a language pack so have purchased Vantage and now to build this up.

For the past few day I've been hitting the Thanks button alot because of these golden nugget information's you guys have given us!

Thank you again!

sidenote:
for those who want to know what script I will be using I will be buying Directorypress I just checked their demo and it has all the things I want(for now) and as alot of people said in this thread you can always customize your directory later when it is already successful.

Fermina... I just got my domain...looking for the script or template myself now.

Thanks for your article, I was thinking of building a directory about SEO niche! I will build a directory by my own when I have proper scripts.

I have already got the site up within a week and now it is also ranking 4 in Google dot com for the main keyphrase. I am excited.

I am just trying to finalize something on the site, and then get in touch with the businesses to convince them to list their business on my directory.

Thank you John for the great idea.

John,

Quick question, how do you get pass the gatekeeper if you didn't know the name of the owner?

GREAT GREAT GREAT stuff btw. I finished reading Bower Formula 2.0 last night.

Hey John, Great Post!

I have a localized social network that gets a good bit of traffic and members. Do you think I could do a localized directory built into this social network and charge $50 a month?

Hi,

I just read the whole thread and of course it gave me lots of ideas.

I've made some quick research and found a high paying niche ITEM+MANUFACTURERS with 210 exact searches.

124k competition with mainly alibaba, made-in-china and globalsources on the 1st page.

I know nothing about SEO really. Can I rank there fairly quickly?

Thank for this thread!

John, thanks for starting this thread ... it's golden!

I have skimmed through most posts but I cannot seem to find an answer to my question, which is: If I wanted to hire a professional telemarketer to sell Ads for my local Australian directory, where would you recommend I go to find that telemarketer ie, oDesk, WF, or ?

Also, what percentage of sale (commission) should I pay the telemarketer?

I came across a FB directory app not long ago. Right here in the WSO section.

Basically you can build directories within FB. Good part is you don't worry about SEO at all.
Bad thing is you have to maintain the page to make sure people come back to it and interact to show value to your customers. You can easily get ppl by paid FB ads.

What do you guys think about it?

Thanks.
O.

That's enough to turn it down lol.

Thanks

@Coffeecashnow

Yeah the getting mobbed part didnt sound too nice eh? lol It happened to me once. Still does really, even here, but when you are talking about offline clients, rebel rousing gets ugly quick.

Ok,

I found a keyword with 4,400 exact search but it s not local. exact domain is taken but I could have keyworddirectory.com (keyword tool shows low competition, but when I type "keyword" it returns 1,120,000 results!)

Is this any good for ranking?

The fact that it s not local, are there enough searches then?

Thanks

EDIT: after checking superpages, it appears that plenty of my prospects have no website. But I wonder if this is good. On one hand we could sell them their presence online, on the other hand, it seems they never showed any interest in online marketing. What do you think?

By the way, is a domain name like this:

KEYWORD+Listing.com

Is good?

Does it sound and look good?

Thanks

Very smart idea Josh!

What amount of traffic do you get with $100, would you tell in what niche too?

Regards.

It seems like you would want their competition on there because then they would have to list their business on your directory because that company wouldn't want their competition getting in front of more potential customers than they are. Maybe you should make them see the scarcity of your product and why they should act now by only allowing a set number of list positions per category, location or however you choose to group everything. Once all the slots gets filled no one else can get listed unless someone drops. That might help to get them to act now if they thought ther cometition might be in front of more customers and that they might get left out in the cold if all the spot get filled. Just a thought not sure if it would work.

Makes sense, I always think that if there are less than 5000 searches, you couldn t get 5000 visitors. But obviously with content network you can!

Thanks.
O.

So I've setup a couple of directory sites. I have manually added around 30 local listings into the basic free listings section. I am offering Featured Listings @ $50 p/mth.

Here is the response I get we I call the business owner: "Oh, thank you for your offer, but just put us down for a Free Listing".

My directory is targetting a geo narrow niche market in a city with a population of over 1 million. My site is ranked No 1 on Google and Bing. Monthly traffic is around 600.

Why is no one interested in buying a featured listing subscription ... any Ideas?

phaproduction,

I definitely would NOT do free listings. With everything you have in place you should have no problem convincing clients you are here to stay.

I do think you should consider some type of "grand opening" incentive though. Tell them what your rates are and stick to it, but you can then offer a special discount for the first 20 clients or a special one time 50% off on a one year sign-up or some other similar idea.

By doing it this way, you have established your rates so there are no tough sells later, you have provided incentive in a monetary way for the client to sign-up now, you will have created some sense of urgency for them to sign-up (only 20 clients get this offer), and you have given the client full indication that they are only the first of many clients you will have.

This is just an idea. If it works for you go for it....if not then then go a different route.

Free always seems like a great offer...but it very rarely works out that way for you OR your client.

Josh, if your market is national, how do you go about it?

I mean if I go after a niche that I want to keep national, with subdomains for each state, then category to target cities/neighborhoods?

I would probably start with 1 town, and get local traffic just as you said, get high ROI, then go after another town and keep doing this...

Would you do it that way?

Thanks.

Thanks Josh.

I believe this niche deserves a national site. However I ll think it over and see if it'd be better to do local and duplicate.

However, there are lots of needed and useful info to put on the site, and if I go with plenty local sites then that would make lots of duplicate content.

It s a bit of a medical niche.

Thanks Josh, you rock!

Cory,

you should be calling people instead of emailing them. And have realistic expectations about your numbers... whether you do payper click or whether you do flyers or direct mail or cold calling- based on your level of skill in any of those areas, you have "numbers".

Learn your numbers, no matter what they are , based on repeating a certain action, a certain number of times, in a certain way... then you can leverage them to get a consistent predictable result.

Based on your skills at writing copy and your distribution method for instance, it make take 1000 flyers to produce two customers...just an off the cuff number...

With cold calling your numbers as a beginner are going to be around 1-100 BUT your first sale may not show up for 150 dials.... you will just average 1-100 over 2 or 3 hundred numbers. Those numbers will improve weekly, not daily. Because you can have bad days, but it all averages out.

That takes about 2-3 hours per day.

Now I wish I could tell you there was a pie in the sky method. I have been happy to hear though that people having been having success with the bower method, and you can too, but email aint gonna get it.

You gotta man up to the phone, or find someone who will, unless you can put out 10k flyers at a time, and have a valid distribution method that is targeted. Perhaps direct mail, or salesman who walk up and hand the biz owners flyer and simultaneously pitch.....

If the person holding the flyers is actually greeting and trying to explain the service the "targeted" people they hand them to, then a minimum of 1 out of 50 flyers is going to be a sale....

In any event, what you are doing wrong is focusing on email.

Thanks John i really appreciate it !

Looking forward to your insights!

Cory, it looks awesome...

I love the look. Its coming together really nicely. I think you could go ahead and start selling off of this , especially at your price... You have something very cool here and Im sure its going to work for you, again, especially at your price. That could either be your USP (The unique price) or , after you build it up more you may want to charge more. The look certainly carries more perceived value than 10 bucks. This is a winner.

What I particularly like is the way the text flows on the "list your business" page...but I can see a couple of tweaks.

I would take out the search bar on the right for this page only so the reader is solely focused on the message, and also to make it more symmetrical, particularly for this page because its the sales message, and its a GREAT one, but you dont want people to feel cramped over to the left, or feel any cramped feelings at all when they read your sales letter. Then you could center the banners at the bottom too. It reads awesome, now you want the page it self to FEEL the way it reads.

As far as text, there are only a couple of tweaks I can see...

This line:

And our listings get over 80 views per day so you are GUARANTEED to be viewed! No question about it!

I would change it to:

The Valley Directory is #1 on Google, exposing your company to potentially thousands of internet customers daily. Our listings get searched EVERY day, so you are GUARANTEED to be viewed! No question about it!

*Thats a true statement that sounds better than "80". You might also take Joshs advice on this thread. Thats an easy no brainer for traffic.

The other line is:

Market research shows that 90% of individuals surveyed would rather SEE and EXPERIENCE something rather than read text.

It sounds a little fabricated even if its not because of the even number "90" , and also to say "of those surveyed" sounds like all too familiar advertising word play.... This line just doesnt seem to flow with the warm flow of everything else.

Maybe if you said "Our" market research that would warm it up some... that way you sound more legit and less vague...

Could be just me though, Im looking for things because you asked, it may go right by an average person.

2 more notes:

I dont know how much local business owners will care about being global unless you are strictly focused on ecommerce sites... However, on another note the "global" thing does attract a certain market of people who are moved by that... Just like some women have a fetish for men with tattoos or whatever. So, while it may be more than some are looking for,; for others it could be JUST the thing they want to hear...So I dont see a need to change that.

Last note, I would just work on symmetry. I would try to put maybe a featured listing of uniform size under each search bar (on the right, and try to make the top and bottom of the text paragraphs line up with the top and bottom of the objects on the right.

Believe it or not symmetry is sooo important...it really is.

Uniformity of listing sizes I think is important too, but maybe thats just me as well. In truth what I have recommended are what I think of as improvements, but your site could sell just fine like it is.

So I hope you didnt take these criticisms harshly; as they were just because I was LOOKING for this stuff.

If you hadnt asked I would probably think "Cool , awesome site! 10 bucks per month? No brainer!"

Hope this helps.

-JD

Ps. Its not your typical hypey squeeze page type copy, but thats good because the site isnt that hypey, its warm and comfortable, and the text flows with that so it delivers a clear message and image that "feels" good.

Very nice.

Awesome directory, Corey!

Strong work!

@coey

No prob. You hear alot of people struggling with closing cold calls charging thousands of dollars... but yours at this value and price will move alot faster than most. Granted you will still get your share of No's but I could see selling these things at a rate of a few per day, and its something that other telemarketers could latch onto easily, so the scalability on this will be easier for you than most. Great "Value".

Re: www . the valley directory .ca

A couple of observations that you might want to address Cory

1. The bottom banner does not have a link to your ListYourBusiness page.

2. Your pale blue category links under each image listing is very hard to read on my screen. I had to highlight it in order to see it clearly

3. The Art & Auto Repair categories on the Browse Listing page are linking to the Antiques page. Unless everyone in the valley are driving around in old bombs as we call them over here then that is probably not a good link for car repairs

4. The community Services category on the Browse Listing page goes to the .png image of the category not a page.

Like John I quite like the sales copy on your list your business page as well as the text on your about us page.

I would definitely put up more free listings or perhaps you can barter a listing for some other service of equal value so that the directory look more established. Once it has more listings it will rank better also and you will find it easier to actually sell new listings at full price.

So after my own dismal failure at trying to get advertisers onboard, I hired a telesales person on oDesk, a Phillipine lady.
I gave her a list of 50 targeted potential businesses to call and told her this would be test run and if she did well I would continue to use her.

She called everyone but made no sales?

Here's what I asked her to do:

a) Ring the business using the script I gave her which included a OTO for signing up today.
b) She would tell them the URL of my landing page where they could enter their contact details into a form. When I received the form I would email them back another form to gather all the relevent info I required for their listing. It also included a PayPal payment option of monthly or yearly.

I never received One form ... boo hoo.

Please share with me how you would go about getting advertisers when using a telesales person.

Hi,

I read this thread and took action. I already have the directory site and now I'm trying to write my cold calling script. I really loved the JD freebie great telemarketing report as I really love that kind of "soft selling". I've tried to adapt the script to my service (and language which is Spanish). It is kind of like this:

"Hi, This is MyName from DirectoryName. We're calling around medical supplies companies to let them know about our web directory service and hopefully drum up some interest. As we're starting we want to offer a one month trial totally free and without any compromise. I was wondering if your company is already in any specialized directory or maybe had any thought to be included in one in the future?"

Is it any good? Is not exactly what I'm going to say on the phone as I am spaniard but the concept is the same. I don't mind to give away a free month since it cost me very little to do the directory (less than 100 bucks in a logo, a template and the domain name since I already had the hosting) and I think that talking about a "free trial" will help me with the cold call.

What do the experts think?

Regards

EDIT: I'm trying talking to me and it is way too long. I'm trying to shorten the message while leaving the concept intact, I'll update soon

One month is not enough time for them to be able to see any value in the lising in my opinion. Unless the site is already ranking in the first 3 positions for your main keywords.

If you are just starting and the directory is bare, you need content in the form of listings ASAP. What I did is I entered lots of free premium listing and then contacted the rest. When They visit the site to check it out then the see lots of competitors listed and they feel they need to join also. They are not aware that initially most of those listings were free. Once the site is established you can remove the free listings and then contact them to join up as PAID members.

Yes, I already have a bunch of "advertisers" (they just don't know it yet, LOL) but I think it is easier to start with "free" on the phone, I guess it can help you to get the foot on the door.

The free month was more about making the listing and let them to take a look (as the directory is really visually apellant) so I could get the decision maker contact data. But then they will also know that probably the other bunch of people are already there for free too so I'm not sure if that is going to help me.

In the other hand, start collecting money right at the beginning will be pretty sweet. I'll take a look at the script to see how can I qualify prospect without too much of pitching.

Regards.

Well, I've retouched the script considering that maybe I shouldn't offer a one month trial because as AussieT said, it is not time enough to perceive any value. Again my script is in Spanish but I'm going to say something like:

"Hi, this is MyName from DirectoryName. We're calling around medical supplies companies to let them know about our service*. I was wondering if your company is already in any specialized medical directory or maybe had any thought to be included in one in the future?"

*Maybe a slight pause here to let them answer?

EDIT: after some practice in the mirror I wanted to shorten even further, I really like the JD concept of "Hey, I'm just calling to say Hi and let you know about my service". Here is what I got (again, not what I'm going to say since I'm spaniard but the concept is the same).

"Hi, this is MyName from DirectoryName. The reason I'm calling is because we're including medical supplies companies in our web and we want to let you know about our service*..."

*Maybe here I could add the "little" unsure technique from JK and finish the phrase with "... but I'm not sure with whom I should have to talk"

Well, today was my first day of cold calling, I must confess that I chickened a little and only did 10 calls, I tried the script with the word "free" and without.

- People was nicer that I expected. Yes, there was a few "not interested" but it was a nice "not interested".

- It seems that the word "free" works pretty well with the gatekeepers, all of them send me directly with the decision maker or told me to call later and ask for him/her (even one was the wife of the owner LOL)

The script I used most of the time was this (but in Spanish):

"Hi, this is MyName from DirectoryName. The reason I'm calling is because we're including free for the first month medical supplies companies in our web and we want to let you know about our service..."

Two of them asked me for the website address.
Two of them said that they're not interested.
One told me that their year marketing budget was empty but I could call next year.
Three of them gave me the name of the DM and told me when to call them.

Also I'm not sure how much to charge. It seems that 147 € (about 190$) a year seems to be a little too much. I'm considering to lower it to 97 € (125$) yearly.

It is a little bit mentally exhausting all of this cold calling stuff but I know it will be worth it. For now I want to take it easy and make about 10 calls a day, I know that it is a very tiny number but I when I started exercising I didn't lift 200 pounds right at the beginning LOL.

Regards

EDIT: I'm also considering the idea of the "mockup" and modify the script just to inform them that I've created their personal listing and they can take a no strings attached look. The downside with this is that the company should have some website where I can get the information but I guess that it will be also a kind of pre-qualifying since they're in Internet already. If I have the material 10 listings a day won't take me more than half an hour and if I can sell one of every ten I'll be more than glad with it.

re: driectory sites...
how do you scrap all the data and input to your directory sites? what scripts are you using? thanks all

Hey John,
Thanks for sharing this Awesome information.
I have a question.
I have a site that I put up to feature local businesses how ever it was a state wide site broken down by counties.

Do you think that I could rank the internal pages with the niche keyword just as quickly as the root domain containing the keyword?

For example: charlestonchineserestaurants.com vs SounthCarolinaBusinessAdvisor.com/charlestonchineserestaurants

Thanks, man. This was really helpfull.

Great info... thank you

Khengo, your site looks great. FYI it is ranking 6 in Google.com.au. Great job!

I am not afilliated with a recent WSO called "Directory Site Empire". I highly recommend it. For around $17 bucks its great value. Just search Directory under the WSO section.

Good luck with your directory site.

Hi there,

ten calls Today, three direct "not interested" and two DM names, one "send me an email with further information" and everything else just didn't answer the phone.

I'm not going to spend time including the listings before selling them, too much of effort to being throwed with something like "we don´t like to be on that many pages!" (actual anwser from one of the DM).

As everyone is showing their directory I'm going to show mine: suministromedico dot es

Regards

Nice idea. Let me implement this strategy.
I live in country with large population. So i think there are many markets untouch.
Thanks.

Quick update:

10 cold emails Today (as I was tired from yesterday and a little bit discouraged) and 1 reply! The DM was interested and asked me about the prices, I don´t know if it just was luck but it was a better response that I got on the phone most of the time (that could indicate that I truly suck at cold calling LOL)

Regards

WOW! This is great stuff. Really appreciate the insight and direction in 'thinking outside the box'. Can't wait to implement it.

Would a directory work for a little village/town?

I have had a site for ages for my village and it get's about 800 visits a month.

It has a population of about 15,000

We have about:

7 restaurants
5 schools
4 gyms

Then a big mix of other shops, a few manufacturers, plumbers, cleaners etc etc

Probably making up 150 businesses in total.

Is this too small of an area to build a directory??

John, thanks for everything.

I will more succesful because of the information and conversation in this thread.

thanks to everyone that participated and again thanks John for answering all these questions

I don't have any questions at this time but I'm making a new thread and I'd like everyone to check it and give me advice/feedback

So sales offer just local business help