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Asking for clientel

by ep2002
17 replies
  • SEO
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Is it normal for SEO companies to say they can't give out their clients due to NDAs?

That seems absurd to me. Why should a company care about that?

I mean if I were a company I wouldn't give out my SEO company, but if another company finds them on their own, then why care if your site is given out. Clearly a potential new customer wants proof they know what they are doing.

The other reason I'm getting is that people steal their customers, but if we are to assume that MOST legit companies hire someone to do their SEO, that would be like a computer company being afraid that someone else would find out the company buys computers LOL
#clientel
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  • Profile picture of the author yukon
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    Originally Posted by ep2002 View Post

    Is it normal for SEO companies to say they can't give out their clients due to NDAs?

    That seems absurd to me. Why should a company care about?

    I mean if I were a company I wouldn't give out my SEO company, but if another company finds them on their own, then why care if your site is given out. Clearly a potential new customer wants proof they know what they are doing.


    I would never show a client to anyone because it's none of their business.

    There's also folks out there looking to steal clients (phishing) by undercutting prices.

    Why are you asking, are you an SEO or buying SEO services?
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    • Profile picture of the author ep2002
      LOL, of COURSE it's their business. ANY company that knows what they are doing is going to ask for proof you know what you are doing. Those are called references & the fact that you think it's none of their business shocks me.

      The fact that you are afraid makes me VERY suspicious about you.

      My guess is that 90% of anyone online who "claims" to know SEO is lying. But this is the same for almost EVERY skill online, only 10% are worth anything.
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      • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
        Originally Posted by ep2002 View Post

        LOL, of COURSE it's their business. ANY company that knows what they are doing is going to ask for proof you know what you are doing. Those are called references & the fact that you think it's none of their business shocks me.(
        Only because you are unaware of key facts.

        Most SEOs will give references to real businesses offline that they can verify but I can come close to guaranteeing that even Mike F above who says he does give them out doesn't give them out to anyone who asks on WF.

        Why?

        Because its risky on MANY levels!!

        You expose the keywords of your client and invite more competition
        You expose the backlinks of the customer and the sites they are using and if you use private or not well known link sources you expose them as well
        You invite reverse engineering and even theft of content etc

        and as Yukon suggested getting customers posing as a client is a great way to try to steal customers.

        and for what on WF? Clients who seldom pay more than a couple hundred a month for only a little time?

        I stopped giving references a long time ago (except to well known or local businesses) online. Every other person fancies themselves an SEO or capable of doing their own SEO. The first thing they always do is run the url through tools that give them all the sites keywords, links and key content.

        I got tired of people PMing me claiming a potential business relationship who eventually made it clear they just wanted to learn how to do it themselves for free on my time. I'll do it for established businesses because they don't have the time to engage in that and they pay faaaaar better.

        You are right about a huge portion of people claiming to be expert SEOs not knowing it but its larger than you think on a place like WF and many online spots. The majority of people here think they can do it themselves which means when a SEO is approached at these places the chances are high they are fishing to learn NOT to hire and to learn on the SEOs free time and dime.
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        • Profile picture of the author ep2002
          Ok, so maybe you have a point there that I didn't understand b/c I try to be as ethical as possible in all aspects of life including business.

          And just so we are clear, this wasn't about WF, I just posted my question on WF b/c I don't know many SEO forums, & on FB, the SEO groups are all run by overseaers who I KNOW don't know what they are doing, so there's no point in asking there.

          I don't run people's URLs thru software. Half the time I don't even understand how the software works to be honest, I wish I knew more.

          I was simply looking for SEOers for my client, & obviously it's my job to find him someone who knows what they are doing.

          BUT, how does getting an URL from an SEOer any different than me taking any random site online who's on the first page & running their URL thru the same software?

          Maybe I'm missing something here, but I could do that too & get all these kws & backlinks, but it takes more than knowing the kws & backlinks to get a site to page one, that much I know.
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          • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
            Originally Posted by ep2002 View Post

            BUT, how does getting an URL from an SEOer any different than me taking any random site online who's on the first page & running their URL thru the same software?
            Simple - you would already have to know the niche and keywords to search for them and their results. The people who are into doing what I referred to like getting profitable niches.

            Second and more importantly you will never know the SEO that did the work but if you approach a SEO under the guise of hiring him you get to both look at his link sources and interview him on his process and how he goes about things . In my younger foolish days I answered all those questions and more than one person would disappear afterwards until one particularly obnoxious slob just said it out straight - great then I will do that myself.

            My fault entirely but to this day SEO is still one of the few professions where you often find the potential hire having to share expertise of how the job should and can be done by the hiring one in order to be hired.

            but it takes more than knowing the kws & backlinks to get a site to page one, that much I know.
            Backlinks in SEO is about 80% of the secret sauce. Frankly I would NEVER give you any client site. "I was simply looking for SEOers for my client," is 9 times out of ten really - "I am or will be charging this customer for SEO and need someone to outsource the work to at a discount so I can take a generous cut for myself in the process"

            So my bet is you are already in the SEO business with this client because I can't see someone being as engaged as you are in finding a SEO if you didn't have a stake in it. For the same reason you probably don't want to pay much so you can get a cut and you probably would prefer to be trained in it so you could get 100%. I just flat out don't believe you approached and are willing to pay any SEO $700 plus a month and they just flat out say - not showing you any clients. I think the truth is you are looking to pay A LOT less and thats why you are getting those answers and for the very same reasons I cited - not worth it and not worth the risk.

            all of which are just bad combinations from the point of view of the SEO. Outsourcing is generally only something a pro SEO agrees to discount for bulk customers not one.

            Now I might be wrong (or even right but you claim its false) but under those situations I'd rather just the person be honest and say - I'd like to learn can't afford much but please mentor me - I've done that because

            A) SEO is not rocket science and a smart person can pick it up in a few weeks
            B) its just a whole lot more honest.
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            • Profile picture of the author ep2002
              Wow, you must really have a sorry life to distrust everyone you come into contact with & accusing them of being liars & unethical just b/c they are vetting people.

              But at least I will NEVER be recommending you to my client & I hope others see what kind of person you really are.

              I won't be responding back to anything you have to say.

              You are one of those SEOers Moz warns everyone about.

              Adios.
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              • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
                Originally Posted by ep2002 View Post

                Wow, you must really have a sorry life to distrust everyone you come into contact with

                Seriously? we should just trust everyone online? Maybe sing a verse of Kumbaya? You mean like you are so trusting that all the SEO facebook groups leaders don't know SEO (but meanwhile claim to not know enough SEO to check links which means you couldn't possibly know enough to know that they don't know SEO)? Thats trusting?

                Nah....Me thinks I hit the nail on the head and the young one is offended -

                All the classic signs

                No one gets this upset and bent out of shape with SEOs they don't want to hire just to get " a SEO for my client". They CLEARLY arre looking to take some off the top and would love to learn enough to take the whole 100%.

                So we are talking about low prices and mystery is solved - low price isn't worth the risk.

                If your client has paid you to find a SEO as apparently he/she did you are not very good at it if you think starting a rant thread on a forum is how its done.


                but there could have been a chance one of you could have gotten the job.
                Not a soul in this thread was interested. What? You think "we don't trust you" means "we would like to work for you"? in what? Klingon? You are like an employee saying I quit after being fired.

                bye
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      • Profile picture of the author yukon
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        Originally Posted by ep2002 View Post

        LOL, of COURSE it's their business. ANY company that knows what they are doing is going to ask for proof you know what you are doing. Those are called references & the fact that you think it's none of their business shocks me.

        The fact that you are afraid makes me VERY suspicious about you.

        My guess is that 90% of anyone online who "claims" to know SEO is lying. But this is the same for almost EVERY skill online, only 10% are worth anything.







        You're asking for a money source (client list) makes me very suspicious of you. I gain nothing, you gain personal details.

        Just because you come to me inquiring about SEO services means nothing, doesn't put a dime in my pocket.

        Why would you consider someone to do SEO when you're unsure about their skills? Makes no sense. I sure as heck wouldn't purposely allow you to stalk other clients and bother them when they have their own business to run. Nobody wants a stranger nosing around their business, for all they know it's competion.

        No thanks, I don't need you as a client. You're a liability.
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        • Profile picture of the author ep2002
          Oh no problem, I wouldn't hire you if you were the last SEOer on earth. Don't worry.
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          • Profile picture of the author yukon
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            Originally Posted by ep2002 View Post

            Oh no problem, I wouldn't hire you if you were the last SEOer on earth. Don't worry.


            Lol, doubtful anyone in this thread would take on such a demanding client. Hypothetically.

            It's funny though, folks around here tend to think as a buyer they hold all the cards. Wrong, potential clients are dime a dozen. The real work is weeding out the tire kickers.
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            • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
              Originally Posted by yukon View Post

              Lol, doubtful anyone in this thread would take on such a demanding client.
              Worse possible sign for a SEO is a prospective client that is claiming to know who doesn't know SEO (as in this case all the facebook SEO group leaders).

              Don't know enough out of one side of their mouth - know it all on the other = royal pain
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  • Profile picture of the author MikeFriedman
    Originally Posted by ep2002 View Post

    Is it normal for SEO companies to say they can't give out their clients due to NDAs?

    That seems absurd to me. Why should a company care about?

    I mean if I were a company I wouldn't give out my SEO company, but if another company finds them on their own, then why care if your site is given out. Clearly a potential new customer wants proof they know what they are doing.

    I have a couple of marketing companies that outsource their SEO work to me. They make me sign an NDA. They never tell the client that they are outsourcing the work to another agency.

    I have some of my own clients too though, and those I can share for anyone that asks.

    Only twice have I ever had a client actually ask me to sign an NDA. It's always been agencies.
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    • Profile picture of the author ep2002
      Ok, got it, so that's a different story, but yeh, if you can provide your own clients, why wouldn't you?

      Thanks
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  • Profile picture of the author Kay King
    Those are called references & the fact that you think it's none of their business shocks me.
    Giving 'references' isn't the same as giving names of your clients to anyone who asks. Clients often offer or agree to be used as a 'reference' - they may provide a written review and/or agree to be contacted.

    The fact that you are afraid makes me VERY suspicious about you.
    And you would be wrong in that case - which is why it's not smart to form opinions based on fear or suspicion. Work with facts. Ask for references and check those references - that's what a business would do.

    That said - when it comes to "SEO" my guess would be 95% are blowing smoke. Those few who know what they are doing and have results to prove it - will provide references to qualified prospects.

    They won't turn over their customer lists or list of sites/businesses they work with - that would be totally unprofessional of them. Truth is - most prospects who would ask for that would not be 'qualified'.
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    • Profile picture of the author ep2002
      LOL, I never asked for their COMPLETE client list.

      I said can you give me some clients you've worked on sites for.

      And references (based on your definition above) is the same as "clients," b/c obviously they can't give me references for NON clients, what would be the point.

      I don't want a reference from their plumber who fixes their toilet, I want references from people they have helped to get on page one.

      And if you also think that 95% of all SEOers are fake, then why in the world would you think they shouldn't be providing proof they can do their job?
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  • Profile picture of the author yukon
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    OP, the way you find the right SEO for your site/s is start with very small projects, work your way up to the bigger projects in stages If you're happy with the results.

    Yes it's trial and error like anything else.

    Yes you should know what you're buying. If you don't know SEO, you're gambling just the same as any other service online or offline where you have no idea about the niche.
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  • Profile picture of the author ep2002
    So since it's clear no one in this thread is a serious SEOer, I'm just unsubscribing.

    Not that I was looking here on WF as I was just asking a simple question that turned into negativity, but there could have been a chance one of you could have gotten the job.

    No problem, I'll find someone some place else where people don't accuse potential clients of lying, trying to steal their clients & being unethical.

    WOW is all I can say

    bye
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