nobodyspecial

Look, it is obvious the whole launch was hyped to death and certain things changed because of greed (700 sales limit removed, original closing date removed, 12 week guarantee removed).

Whenever you want to see who is driving, always follow the money. I had my security guy follow the money. The charge for this is not by Iron Empires in Nevada, but by a LLC in Georgia, owned/controlled by B. Fallon.

Money has it he's calling the shots.

Now whether the course will be worth a damn or not is to be decided, but the whole hype/launch/sales process has been a disgrace and has shown a lot of gurus "have no clothes".

MaskedMarketer

i dont think anything really "changed".

it was how it was suppose to happen

mikewa

If you bought on Dec 10 or 11 you had a 12 week guarantee as below:-
After you complete this 12 week training course, if you don't feel it was worth every single penny and more of your under $2,000 investment, I will refund every give you all your money back with absolutely no strings attached."

I have emailed the support desk several times to see if they are going to honor the original guarantee offered. This is the reply I have received so far:

"It was a typo on our part and we corrected it as soon as it was discovered."

They still don't say whether they are going to honor the original guarantee (as they are legally, ethically and morally required to do) and I am still pressing for a definitive answer.

I certainly do not want to find I have bought yet another product which never gets delivered in its entirety and there is no guarantee to fall back on. I think I have learnt that very expensive lesson now!

I also starting to wonder how many other "typos" there are in the sales letter with regards to earnings etc

MaskedMarketer

let us know how it works out for you. you should probably get a phone number and try to call if that's possible.

nobodyspecial

A couple of sentences is a far stretch to say it was a "typo". Take off your mask, of course things changed ... they changed several things to move towards making and keeping more sales.

A 12 week guarantee prevented them from paying affiliates w/o exposing themselves to a lot of liability. Also reduces the changes and time for customers to get refunds.

The removal of the 700 spots sold allows them to make more $$, plain and simple.

The moving of the course start date allows for a longer sales period and reduces the refund period for earlier buyers.

In summary, the overall ethical nature of the course sellers is pretty poor. How people say the course will be awesome while the nature of the marketing is low is beyond me?

I'm very close to walking away from the whole thing before it begins. I don't like giving dishonest people money (yes, dishonest).

templar

Exactly, and if you have any problems after the course starts, and want a refund, and they don't honor the original offer, then send in a note asking if they can refund or should you request a chargeback from your credit card company. Those cost the vendor $45, so it will get their attention.
As for the course, I think everyone will be ecstatic with no need to refund.

Even Ryan Deiss is on board now, saying it is the real deal...and lift-off is days away.

Congrats to everyone on board, and for everyone else...well, you have a few days left to make a choice.

2 spots in my study group...and no worries if you choose to avoid this opportunity.

Free Crypto Coin Empire

MaskedMarketer

I don't believe it was a "typo" at all. These guys are BS artists. Aymen is probably a great guy. But as far as the launch goes, its terrible.

Did anyone buy in the Stompernet launch? Someone said they changed the gaurantee in one of there launches too?

Its either they are completely stupid or their completely stupid. This is how they are MANUFACTURING buyers remorse. They are going against there word when people dropped 2k on the program. If they do not honor it, I would not stay in the program.

That means you just got played as did everyone else.

I don't have course, but if they don't honor that gaurantee for their customers, thats just stupid. If they messed up, they should pay the price, not the customer. At least apologize and offer a refund right away, but not a "run " around

nobodyspecial

You only get played unless you know how to play the game. Knowing merchant account rules as well as FTC regulations, I have more than enough documentation to enforce the 12 week guarantee if desired.

Amex would gladly give me my money back and a simple call to a FTC regulator with proper documentation so he doesn't have to do investigation would probably get them min. a C&D letter/notice.

Now, I have no desire to waste my time doing either. If the guys want to put on a sleeze fest, by all means let them. I have better use of my time.

Of course I'd like to learn the information if valid. This desire is not overridden by lowering/violating my business ethics to deal with non-desirables.

MaskedMarketer

Knowing the rules is good, but if a business makes you go through that, thats just terrible business practices. The thing is, many people will not follow through and just take the loss.

If they would refuse the 12 week guarantee they promised you, i'd ask for a refund immediately. thats just nonsense.

I think the Attorney General should be able to help to, right?

I hate to see you or anyone have to go threw that BS because of the businesses fault.

Good luck, and let us know how it works out

nobodyspecial

I won't waste my time. I'll see how the first week goes ... if BS, the plug will be pulled quickly.

Val911

Bravo I agree James, can't believe the attitude some folks have here hmmm ... guys the great thing about any offer is that you can work it test it for 30 days or some offers longer and if it doesn't work you get your money back - like James said why be negative if you haven't seen the whole enchilada yet.. some make it happen, some watch whats happening and some wonder what the hell happened.... the ones smiling going to the bank are the ones that make it happen.!

Join the Conspiracy before doors close Dec 31st and receive over US $ 10,000 in bonuses from top Guru's
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psresearch

That's a good point.

I guess the only place it might not make sense is if one of the main intents of the course is to train affiliates for his new Affiliate Network.

I would think in that case you would want the trainees to be able to proceed through the course without the stress of an imminent refund-date hanging over their head since added stress like that tends to make learning less effective.

Work At Home Truth - Extra Income Edition | Swindles.org

ebuynz

can you send me a code to access your site please

tradermike2008

It wasn't stompernet that happened with, but pipeline profits. It was another fallon snow job though.

I'm the ownder of WallStreetWindow.com where I do several big mega launches a year. I also moderate a mastermind group of financial stock trading/forex marketers and affiliate marketers who shares ideas and a launch calendar check it out: http://theprivatealliance.com

tradermike2008

I was a subscriber to stompernet and last week canceled it. I just got disugsted by this launch and felt like I no longer wanted to be a part of stompernet as a result. I know Andy Jenkins posted here saying stompernet was not involved, but it is hard for me not to make the connection, because it is clear that Fallon was a big force behind this launch and many of the stompernet affiliates were sent stuff to promote this without having signed up to it. I think this launch was totally disgusting - from the hype, paying people for testimonials, and now how they treated the customers. I simply lost trust. And I do not want to do business with someone I do not trust. Pretty simple. I sent an explanation in my email cancellation and of course got no reply. That says something too.

One last thought about this. Maybe these guys are not as big as they seem to be. Take a look at this launch for instance. They sold 1,700 spots it has been said for 2k a spot. That's 3.4 million. Sounds like a big number. But it isn't as big as it seems to Fallon and this Aymen character. Cut it in half because they have to pay the affiliates. Now you have 1.7 million. Now how much are they splitting it amongst themselves? The "launch director," website design, hosting, etc costs too. Refunds. I'm guessing Fallon and Aymen are actually making around 500k a piece at the most. It could be Fallon is making the bulk of it and if so Aymen is just making a few 100k.

These guys give you the impression they are raking in the millions. Aymen 100k a day claims. They do all of this hype and desperate sleazy selling so they can make around 500k - an amount of money that shouldn't be a big deal to them.

Its like going to a car lot and having a used car salesmen telling you he is a milionaire and not letting you leave the lot so he can sell you a $500 lemon.

Either these guys aren't as loaded as they appear and will do or say anything for a sale including paying testimonials, claiming the server is down, saying it is going to sell out and start then keeping it open, or else they just got a kick out of selling people like this. They aren't in it for the money, but for the thrill and if that is the case they are really one trick ponies.

This will be my last post on this thread. It is a waste of energy and time. To the newbies who got sucked in good luck.

I'm the ownder of WallStreetWindow.com where I do several big mega launches a year. I also moderate a mastermind group of financial stock trading/forex marketers and affiliate marketers who shares ideas and a launch calendar check it out: http://theprivatealliance.com

lisawood

I think it's another over-hyped promotion. got a ton of cash? try it out and see

Black Hat Cat

500k is a lot of money....period. Plus it's an extra 500k on top of what he gets when his cpa network is up and running. But I'm with you, there's no way I believe he is earning $25-$35 million a year....sorry, I just don't. If he is, good for him, but I'm not buying it....or his course. It may be golden, but too many red flags for me to take that chance.

strsinthesky

Lol 25 - 35 million is a 10 million difference. Alot of gurus talk alot.

Jays80

If anyone is earning $25 to 35 Million year, unlikely to put his reputation at stake for a 2k membership even if it earns him couple of million dollars

tmedocianis

Why do you guys argue/debate about how much people make? Aren't income records a matter of public record? Simply do the research and look them up! My personal bet is that alot of people would probably be very disappointed. Don't believe the hype! Didn't that use to be a song?

MaskedMarketer

We aren't being negative- we are re-acting to the deceit that these people push.

And that must be the oldest quote in the book.

What I find funny is, that Aymen is new to CPA (or coaching to large groups like this). This is the First time he is presenting this course.

Everyone who signed up, you're working with someone who has never taught this before to a large group like this. (or maybe he's hiding his past customers testimonials :confused

You're almost his "test" subjects for this launch.

Now because we don't go alone with the hype you say that silly quote?

PPC Coach already has is own network. And he's probably been doing it longer than Aymen. And he charges only 50$ a month. I'm not endorsing him, but I'd rather go with someone that is proven, someone who's probably been doing it longer, someone who HAS there own network in place already, and has already been established.

It makes more sense for me to work with someone who :

1. Has there own ESTABLISHED CPA network
2. Has probably been doing it longer
3. Doesn't add a bunch of hype and overcharge (to afford to pay affiliates)
4. Has STUDENTS testimonials and not paying for them

The thing is, no one has seen the whole course yet, so its all speculation. Which is why I'd go with someone who is proven. but thats just my personal opinion.

That's just speculation.

pa321

Guy's it looks it is the same story of always.When i get in PPc Classroom they said at the end of the 30 days that they will stop the access to the main site to all of us do not join the monthly rate of 29,99 i guess.We all said do it and i will go to my lawyer so they go back on their decision.At the same time half of the bonuses they promise they never arrive and they practically emarginate all of us who do not acceed to pay the monthly rate.If you could see how they treat us during the days when they realize that not all of us we will join something they never said before during the launch they where arrogant and dishonest.Last time i will buy something from those guys .And also if you see in the classroom it is easy to say join this 497$ service and you will have the perfect keyword list and you will dominate Adwords.But in the sales letter they hype that they dont make us spend another dollar to Dominate the PPC world so how it is?I say NO MORE products from GURUS specially if they push one each other is a sort of Mob did you realize it?I mean THERE ARE NOT magical formulas and those guys they have one per month always saying this is from a regular guy like you.Where in the world a regular guy can manage a 20.000 keywords campaign on google or 3-4 services of 497 each??
ANSWER TO YOURSELF and be sincere it is always your desire of easy money that make you buy this products we all know that they are not useful but we WANT TO BE FRAUDED WE LOOK FOR THE DEFINITIVE GUIDE AND LIKE THAT WE WILL ONLY FILL THEIR POCKET OF HARD EARNED DOLLARS
Cheers

SarahMcHarry

If Brad Fallon is behind this then it must be because he wants to establish his own CPA network. I can understand that he wants to diversify because, in the upcoming recession, there's probably not going to be an expanding market for cheap, imported-from-China wedding favors...

Sarah

Black Hat Cat

What reputation? No one ever heard of him before this launch. He doesn't rely on his reputation for his CPA earnings anyway. No one cares about your reputation when they're filling out a zip submit. AC could tank completely, his name could become dirt in the IM arena, and it wouldn't affect his CPA earnings one bit.

Eric Graudins

The sales machine for this thing is still churning folks.
Just noticed the following interesting statement re refunds in MikeFil saime's latest promo for this product, sent after Aymen and Brad quote "Kept working on him while he was driving home, to add another product to all the other bonuses" unquote"

I reckon they'd be better off working on their dissatisfied clients instead of hassling poor old overworked Mike to chuck another bonus on the fire! But That's just me. I'm not a hot shot marketer, What the hell would I know.

===Paste from MikeFil saime sales promo, 7:13am, 28/12/08 (Aussie time) ====
REMEMBER - If you ask for a refund, they
give you back 100% of your money PLUS
$500 extra. That is how confident they
are in their program. I have never seen
anyone make that claim. They must really
know how good this will be.

===== End Paste from M.F. promo =====

No mention of jumping through any hoops like proving to Aymon that you've tried the system.
Don't worry about the fine print, or the constantly changing terms.
Just believe good ol' Mike. HE certainly wouldn't get his facts wrong. Would he!

The biggest benefit of the internet is that almost everything can be automated.
The biggest curse of the internet is that almost everything can be automated.

MaskedMarketer

"If you ask for a refund, they
give you back 100% of your money PLUS
$500 extra."

Normally if the company were reputable they would put an asterisk there to give you the "terms and conditions". You can not just ask for a refund and get it back, lol- what the hell is mike saying?

RonHamernik

The following is only an opinion based solely on this thread. I have no additional information other than what has been posted on this thread.

"1" is the magic number to certify a class action. We have interstate action. We have concerted representations that are leading people to rely on them. We have pecuniary gain. We have color of authority. We have potential non-delivery of a product after collection of funds.

I've been waiting for someone to stick their neck out too far. I didn't expect that so many people would leave themselves wide open to litigation. This is potentially a multimillion dollar lawsuit waiting to happen, in the hands of a talented trial lawyer. If any of these guys have insurance . . . . If any of these guys DON'T have insurance . . . . .

Almost seems like a perfect storm for the story of the year. In any case, if nobody takes action, I predict that within the next 5 years there will be a large scale action (meaning lawsuit) against gurus who don't deliver on their claims.

Of course, they will always be protected by their own passive, almost indifferent, customers who don't take action . . . . like sheep to the slaughter.

cnwoods

I got the report, and started looking into it. The CPA networks he mentions want people who already have huge traffic, and review every application manually. So, nix on the newbies.

I think this is probably about the online equivalent of the rash of "make money through real estate wrapping/flipping/arbitrage" that went around a few years back (and started a train of events we're all paying for today). Yes, he thinks bigger than most, but there are very few people would be comfortable jumping from the mindset of an ebay merchant/affiliate marketer to the debt confidence levels of a real estate developer.

Personally, I thought it was great material for helping stretch the mindset to start looking at higher end products and therefore profits. As for the strategy, it wasn't one for me. I prefer delivering stuff I know, love and happily recommend because then I KNOW I'm giving good value. That, to me, is a safer long-term strategy.

The 13th Warrior

That course, man, better be interesting.

$2,000 for a collection of intellectual musing of UN-applicable probabilities,stories and/or theories with fluff layered in-between as icing is going to be unacceptable.

Purchaser of course, at worst, should be able to make back his investment of course purchase within a reasonable time, if it has some amount of merit at all to justify that high end price.

How would a guru save face on this one if it goes bad?

If, however, they over-deliver, all will be forgotten and their praises would be sung.

They should be calling all those gurus for help on this one, to save face and reputation of all, if it's needed.

The 13 th Warrior

ToddieM

I can defintely see the value of the last paragraph. I mean by us recommending products shilled by the CPA networks really makes us no different than the gurus we are slamming who basically did the same. We know precious little about most of them, yet we are recommending them. Interesting how all of us kettles are getting called black, hunh?
As to the nixing of newbies, to AC's defense, they did specify in the first "pre-call" how to get around that. Their solution was really quite obvious, and I have already been accepted into one CPA network.

Wireless payment

rebounder trampoline

ibconsultants

The Dark Side - CPA Marketing on Steroids

Keith Baxter is charging $5,000 CASH in the form of a bank wire to get his knowledge.

Who is Keith Baxter?
I know he has Word Press Project

Please reply!

Adrianne

James Schramko

Not quite as informative as yours Tristan.

Take your spammy Maverick Money Makers re-direct links to another forum. Read the rules.

This is where you get real information (backed up by proven results)

James Schramko

Many new people have been accepted with guidance from the program. There is a proper way to do to and so far so good.

This is where you get real information (backed up by proven results)

seanybyrne

Hey Guys,

I thought that direct linking to merchants (in this case CPA offers) was difficult to do in google and Yahoo! What if other advertisers are promoting the same merchant url as you are? Am I right in saying that your ads dont show up all the time if that happens? Dont you need to create landing pages for keywords that you are promoting for the CPA offer?

Just some considerations to take into account..

Cheers,

Sean

James Schramko

There are ways to get around it assuming you don't want to be a strong bidder or avoid competition by being the only bidder on creative keywords

Some people have a generic domain where they host the banners on it. Some people frame offers in a domain
Others re-direct until they get caught
Others make mini themed sites
Others make authority sites

There are other ways too such as having the merchant set up a cloned domain for you or using non-google sources like PPV, Pop-unders or network banners.

This is where you get real information (backed up by proven results)

PPC-Coach

A lot of the money made with cpa offers via direct linking is on the second tier ppc networks too. Don't fall in love with google adwords only. You'll pull your hair out doing that. I'm sure they're going to cover that in the course, but ppc engines like:

ABCsearch
7search
Findology

And a couple more are very good sources of traffic when direct linking to email or zip submits.

seanybyrne

"There are ways to get around it assuming you don't want to be a strong bidder or avoid competition by being the only bidder on creative keywords

Some people have a generic domain where they host the banners on it. Some people frame offers in a domain
Others re-direct until they get caught
Others make mini themed sites
Others make authority sites

There are other ways too such as having the merchant set up a cloned domain for you or using non-google sources like PPV, Pop-unders or network banners."

Hey James,

When you talk about using a generic domain and hosting banners on it... can you give me an example?

Like a html page where the visitor will simple click on the banner to be directed to the CPA offer?

Is using the cloned domain a popular method? Will many merchants accept this as a way for you to promote their offer directly from you via PPC?



"A lot of the money made with cpa offers via direct linking is on the second tier ppc networks too. Don't fall in love with google adwords only. You'll pull your hair out doing that. I'm sure they're going to cover that in the course, but ppc engines like:

ABCsearch
7search
Findology

And a couple more are very good sources of traffic when direct linking to email or zip submits."


Hey PPC coach,

Are these PPC engines also good for other CPA offers that take more time to fill in fields?

Thanks,

Sean

EliteAffiliate

Has anyone received a refund yet? I sent in my request for a refund last week and have still not even received a response or confirmation that they received my email. Only more emails promoting it. Anyone? I don't know how long I should wait until I call my CC company. I mean, almost seems as though they are holding off until after the 30 days to get back to me on anything, and can claim it is too late! They never even gave me the fast action bonuses even though I signed up on the 10th. Now they are giving away more stuff only to people who sign up now. Insane. I get better service from people who sell $10 ebooks.

mikewa

Yes, I received a refund as I paid twice. The shopping cart declined my Visa but still deducted the amount. In the meantime I used my Mastercard. Having said that, they did not reply to my two emails for several days until after I had made a post on this forum asking whether anyone else was having problems with refunds . . .

If anyone needs a copy of the sales letter dated Dec 11 with the original 12 week guarantee in, let me know and I will send it in a pdf!

James Schramko

Hi Sean,

Yes you can host banners on your own domain and drive traffic to it.

With the cloned domain name a merchant will set it up for you if you can drive huge traffic to it. This is when you are on the same payout level as the CPA companies and you get a better cut. (Wholesale).

On of the most popular method affiliates try is framed re-directs. Type just about any Clickbank product into Google and you will see people using this method even though it is not allowed...

This is where you get real information (backed up by proven results)

Jeff Olah

EliteAffiliate -

Yes, I received a refund from them. Just be persistent. I had to send them seven emails and threaten them with a credit card dispute and then they finally answered.

All has been taken care of.

I think they are just very busy with very happy customers or they are still trying to process all the mounting refunds.

It's up to you to decide which.

Take care

Jeff

mido

Thank you Mike, here is part of it, I recorded on Dec. 11, 5:02 PM EST

"Oh yeah, and if for any strange reason you didn't think this is for you, I'll give you a...

A 100% Money-Back Guarantee #1!

After you complete this 12 week training course, if you don't feel it was worth every single penny and more of your under $2,000 investment, I will refund every give you all your money back with absolutely no strings attached."

Mark

phpBay and phpZon for Relevant Listings
Webloader WP Solutions

digabot

This is what's on the site:

"If after following our entire 12 week system step by step, creating an average of 2 campaigns per day (approx 30 minutes each once you perfect the process), you have not recovered the full cost of the course, simply send us your logins to verify the campaigns you’ve built and revenues generated, and we’ll refund you every penny PLUS an additional $500!"

According to that, you need to show them that you launched over 150 campaigns AND give them all your PPC Account Logins before they refund + $500.

If you test that many campaigns and fail you will be down a hell of a lot more than $2500 considering you need to test with AT LEAST $100 per campaign.

The guarantee above just sounds good but you'll have lost a ton of money before you can get your $2500. On the other hand, if you can't make $2500 after testing 150 offers, you need to find another way to make money online.

jredder

Yes I agree that the overall report does have good information. Plus keep in mind that depending on who the report was initially designated for, it more then likely delivered. Reports like this aren't intended for everyone

scottyg

Nothing is stopping you from starting your own cpa network if you have about $15 thousand dollars to invest in direct trak software that is the back bone of most cpa networks.

The whole reason for this launch was to get you to sign up for THEIR cpa network they are starting up.

xenter

If Aymen is so successful and he was just an average joe before, then why does price his product so high? Doesn't he remember what is like to be broke but have the drive to do whatever it takes to succeed?

Do you guys think we can go ask him and ask for profit sharing?

Alright Aymen, you teach me what to do, I'll do it, and you keep 80% of the profit for 3 months. That should pay for the original price many times over!

I'll even throw in video 20 testimonials.

ddomains

I asked for a refund on this one, but to their credit I have to say they responded promptly. For me, this launch was just a huge expose of how willing some so-called gurus are to rent out their reputations to the next flavor-of-the-month infoproduct. I lost some respect for a few of the marketers involved in this product launch (from what I've read, I'm not the only one who feels that way), and I think the people who are going to come out ahead on this one in the long run are those who sat on the sidelines.

J Bold

Uh, no, the income of private individuals is not public. The only thing that's public is the money a company traded on the stock market makes.

J Bold

Just start a new topic about this. This topic is about the Arbitrage Conspiracy.

dragunov

I also like the report to an extent